Other Mapping Tools

General discussion on mapping.

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outzenj
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 5:14 pm

Other Mapping Tools

Post by outzenj » Sat Nov 15, 2014 4:35 pm

What other tools have you used to make maps? What are the pros and cons? Do you hope OWM is a replacement for these tools, or a supplement to them?

A couple notable tools I've used:

AutoRealm - A pretty great tool for world maps, but had some serious bugs. Has a lot of the tools OWM will have - fractal curves, shorelines, layers, text-on-paths, multiple views of the same map, to name a few that I can remember. Has a decent built-in symbol library (especially for fantasy maps), including a variety of styles of city and terrain markers, compasses, and rosettes. But the BUGS... bezier curve control points would almost always snap really far away from where you wanted; some symbols and text would stay a fixed size when you zoomed, but others would zoom normally, and it always seemed arbitrary; some tools would randomly cancel themselves in the middle of an action; undo would sometimes stop working... I gave up trying to use this tool a few years ago, but at the same time there's not really a good replacement. Hopefully OWM is that replacement - and an improvement.

HexMapper - A really simple tool for basic world and wilderness maps. My only beef with it is the aesthetic - hex maps just don't work for me.

Adobe Illustrator - Full featured vector drawing program. In theory you can make some amazing-looking maps using Illustrator - but that's not what it's built for, and the learning curve is obnoxious. I've tried a few times to make sense of this program - even got to the point where I could make some simple, decent-looking drawings - but almost every time I'm tried to use it for a map, I've given up and switched to something else.

SketchUp - An easy-to-use 3D drawing tool, intended as a sort of entry-level architectural or engineering CAD program. Works nicely for really complex multi-level dungeons or worlds, where you want to make sure that everything lines up, or are having a hard time grasping the overall structure, but for anything else it's overkill. And unless you spend a lot of time with it, the end result is going to look like an engineering drawing, not a map. I've used SketchUp as a starting point a couple times, but then switched to other software to actually draw the map.

Dervish
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2014 2:09 pm

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by Dervish » Sun Nov 16, 2014 5:11 am

Campaign Cartographer 2/3 Discovered CC2 back when 2nd edittin AD&D came out with Core rules computer programat the time it wa overly complicated and i did not really ejoy it now it is the mainstay of my mapping needs

Fractal Mapper 5,6,7,8 I have betatested for ed on an off for years now Fractal mapper is extraordinarily easy to use howwever its maps rare;y if ever look quite as good as a map don in CC3

Inkarnate (beta testing)This is a more recent addition on the mapping scene and while at the current time its tool set is very primitive you can still put out a semi decent looking map.

Autorealm - Tried it did nto really tickle my fancy

Gimp&Photoshop Not so much for map making itself but textures, backgrounds and basic tile work.
on my android tablet
Autodesk Sketch with a decent stylus you can draw maps with easy ability to use layers

To be completely honest I am not expecting OWM to replace any of my current map programs i am fine with CC3 and FM8 however several of my group are wanting to try their hands at GM'ng and like me they prefer to make their own maps and CC3 has a distinct learning curve even with Joe Sweenie's tutorials can take a bit to get used so i am hping that OWM has a quick learning curve so i can throw t to the rest f the group.

freeAgent
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:20 am

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by freeAgent » Sun Nov 16, 2014 9:22 pm

I've used Hexographer and Dungeonographer, but they are coded in Java (yuck) and look pretty basic. However, they allow you to make perfectly serviceable maps. I'm hoping that Other World Mapper will be at least as easy to use and functional while using a more modern UI and not using Java :)

Toodice
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:09 pm

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by Toodice » Sun Nov 16, 2014 11:21 pm

Campaign Cartographer 2/3 Discovered CC2 back when 2nd edittin AD&D came out with Core rules computer programat the time it wa overly complicated and i did not really ejoy it now it is the mainstay of my mapping needs
Yeah, it's complicated but that's only part of the issue. The program crashes randomly but often, to the point where the built-in autosave still isn't enough to stop a substantial amount of work from being lost unless if you develop an extreme habit of saving at every given moment. Even without crashing, it still behaves erratically from time to time. I had a play with it again recently and discovered that even with the default templates, the shading can sometimes change permanently between different instances of the same brush, and as this was the result of a bug rather than function there was no way to correct it. Finally they've made the creation of custom styles so difficult with no documentation and no in-app ways to go about it that I'm certain that this was a direct ploy to sell their custom templates. If they were sold individually that wouldn't be a problem, but instead you need to buy an annual containing several styles and articles in what seems to be purely an attempt to push up the price.

A tool that hasn't been mentioned yet is Inkscape. It's similar to Adobe Illustrator in that it's a vector imaging program, but it's open source. It isn't a dedicated mapping tool, but it's extremely advanced and may well suit those who find mapping with bitmap tools a bit awkward. It doesn't have Campaign Cartographer 3's power with regards to using textures within shapes but it can reproduce most of the special effects.
Last edited by Toodice on Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

gareth_w
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2014 2:00 pm

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by gareth_w » Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:11 pm

I've used a variety of tools in the past - including both the big ones - Campaign Cartographer and Fractal Mapper.

Of the two, Fractal Mapper is preferred, though I give it a 2/10 overall. Campaign Cartographer's latest addons won't even install for me; but the program is a pig and I just can;t get my head around it.

Both of these programs make the mistake of trying to be a cartography tool AND an art package. And do both badly. I particularly do not like CC's implementation of styles - to me you should make a map and then choose what style to render it in. For example, I might want to render my ultra perfect world map as a pencil scrawl for the players - templates should (in my opinion) be the last thing that is added!

I also use GIMP, Paint, Powerpoint and Excel - which is great for quick and dirty grid maps for dungeons, etc.

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Big Mac
Posts: 94
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 6:08 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by Big Mac » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:12 pm

outzenj wrote:What other tools have you used to make maps? What are the pros and cons? Do you hope OWM is a replacement for these tools, or a supplement to them?
I have used a "Pencil" and "Pen" to make maps. :P

I've not made anything recently. :cry:
David "Big Mac" Shepheard
(A Spelljammer fan hoping to user Other World Mapper to make lots of maps of planets.)
You can see more of me over at The Piazza campaign settings forums

paulpacheco
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:57 pm

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by paulpacheco » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:31 pm

For homemade RPG use I've used the aforementioned pen & (graph)paper, as well I've spent hours upon hours simulating that effect with MS Paint. I attached an example map. You can hopefully see trees, roads, highway overpass, rail yard, and the far mid-right is a water mill. Numbers are a relative depth indicator.

As you can imagine this type of mapping is very basic and nowhere near the level of detail I want to use in my novels. That is why I'm excited about this project.
Attachments
Duke Map A4.png
Duke Map A4.png (81.44 KiB) Viewed 14800 times

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Big Mac
Posts: 94
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Location: London, UK

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by Big Mac » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:08 pm

paulpacheco wrote:For homemade RPG use I've used the aforementioned pen & (graph)paper, as well I've spent hours upon hours simulating that effect with MS Paint. I attached an example map. You can hopefully see trees, roads, highway overpass, rail yard, and the far mid-right is a water mill. Numbers are a relative depth indicator.

As you can imagine this type of mapping is very basic and nowhere near the level of detail I want to use in my novels. That is why I'm excited about this project.
Wow. Nice map Paul. (And it is great to see you over here too. :D )

I would be interested to see you make the same map with OWM, when it comes out, to see how much better you can make it look.
David "Big Mac" Shepheard
(A Spelljammer fan hoping to user Other World Mapper to make lots of maps of planets.)
You can see more of me over at The Piazza campaign settings forums

stefanstr
Posts: 108
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:25 pm

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by stefanstr » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:37 pm

Art Set for the iPad.

Not a mapping tool per se but I find it easier than drawing on paper.

paulpacheco
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:57 pm

Re: Other Mapping Tools

Post by paulpacheco » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:10 pm

stefanstr wrote:Art Set for the iPad.

Not a mapping tool per se but I find it easier than drawing on paper.
Paper kind of bothers me too. I like things to be fairly uniform (like a real map) and I'm not one of those people who get better the more times they draw something. For example, drawing the trees would see them slowly degrade into an array of tree-like shrubbery.
Big Mac wrote:Wow. Nice map Paul. (And it is great to see you over here too. :D )
Thanks. It's for a car-based RPG.

What I do is start off with a blank graph-like page. I then use paint to fill squares with a colour-coded system (ie. green for trees, blue for water, gray for paved road, etc). After I sufficiently get a design going I copy>paste the items from a template/legend. For example these are some building templates.
Duke Map ^Items.png
Duke Map ^Items.png (3.94 KiB) Viewed 14790 times
I then use the right-click erase to bring everything back to white.
Big Mac wrote:I would be interested to see you make the same map with OWM, when it comes out, to see how much better you can make it look.
Hmm, come to think of it that might be a good way to get my feet wet.

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